OTTAWA – Today and yesterday witnesses stressed the importance of getting Bill C-11, the Online Streaming Act, right to members of the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications – right for both broadcasters navigating a changing media landscape and for content creators who have built careers around the way things work online now.
Brad Danks, CEO of OUTtv spoke about the difficulties they have faced negotiating carriage on some online platforms and specified what he believes is needed is for the CRTC to be a backstop in the online environment as it currently is for Canada’s traditional broadcasting system.
“We want to know that they’ve got our back,” he said. “We want the platforms to know that if they come into Canada and if there aren’t fair terms, if there aren’t carriage deals there, the CRTC could step in and set those terms.”
Danks pointed out there is not much they can do right now if streamers decide not to work with them.
This is important at least in part because it ties into the question of funding for programming.
APTN, which has mandatory carriage in Canada, receives about 90% of its revenues from the $0.35/subscriber/month subscription fee it receives through the traditional broadcast system, Monika Ille, CEO of APTN told the committee.
Ille went on to point out that as people migrate online, they “hope the CRTC would be able to set terms like that, coming with a fixed rate, in the case of section 9(1)(h) and mandatory carriage.” If this does not happen, it stands to reason they may struggle to maintain the level of funding they currently generate.
“I think the CRTC truly believed in the importance of what APTN is doing, and I think they still do today,” Ille said. “They have not abused their power in the way the Broadcasting Act is written right now, so why can’t we give them the authority to be able to resolve a dispute and set the terms in the years to come? I’m not only thinking in the short term but in the medium and long term. Hopefully, we won’t review this Broadcasting Act in another 30 years. We’ll review it before, as things are changing, but we need to give flexibility to the CRTC to be able to do that.”
Aldo Di Felice, president of TLN Media Group Inc. and member of the Canadian Ethnocultural Media Coalition, who presented on another panel yesterday, said they support giving the CRTC the same authority in the online world over aggregators as they have in the linear broadcast world over broadcasting distribution undertakings.
“It’s a simple concept of ensuring that they at least have the authority to ensure that channels and content are carried on fair terms,” he told the committee. “How they exercise that authority will be up to them, based on a track record of having exercised it fairly responsibly over the decades.”
While there is concern about what will happen to the Canadian broadcasting system if Bill C-11 is not passed and the CRTC does not have the ability to, as Danks put it, act as a backstop, TikTok and YouTube appeared before the committee to caution about what could happen to Canadian content creators if the bill is passed as it is currently written.
A concern several platforms have expressed relates to discoverability and the possibility for algorithms to be ordered to be altered.
Organizations including Spotify and the Digital Media Association (which represents the interests of Amazon, Apple, Google, Pandora, Spotify and YouTube) last week warned against giving the CRTC powers over algorithms.
This topic was taken up again today.
Senator Julie Miville-Dechêne asked why there is concern about discoverability requirements when platforms have been telling the committee they already promote Canadian content.
The senator pointed out there is nothing in the legislation that specifically refers to algorithms, arguing “the obligation is towards results, achieving the results.” (Her question was asked in French and translated into English).
“I have difficulty understanding your strong opposition to this since moreover you are telling us you are doing everything to promote Canadian content, so could you please explain this paradox?”
YouTube’s head of Canada government affairs and public policy Jeanette Patell (above, left) said they heard from the chair of the CRTC that while the CRTC cannot require them to use a specific algorithm or source code there is “sufficient wiggle room” in the language of the bill for the CRTC to ask for algorithms to be manipulated to achieve specific outcomes.
Miville-Dechêne, however, said it is not written in the bill that platforms would have to manipulate their algorithms. “You have to choose the means to make Canadian content discoverable. You can choose those means, so why are you afraid,” she asked.
Patell explained what they want is more precision in the text so it is clear they cannot be ordered by the CRTC to use a specific algorithm or be given an order by the CRTC that would result in changes to their algorithm.
Danks, yesterday, also provided the committee with his thoughts on the debate about discoverability and algorithms.
“Discoverability is about being treated fairly,” he said, adding that he is against preferences of content being provided through algorithms.
Danks explained to the committee customers are not going to click on links just because the content was recommended. “I honestly think this whole discussion is such a waste of time because even if it is tried, I don’t believe it would work,” he said.
Meanwhile in the Senate earlier today, second reading of Bill C-11 began. Senator Dennis Dawson spoke about the bill, but there were only two minutes for questions as earlier in the day they adopted a motion to end at 4 p.m. on Wednesdays and time had run out.
Screenshot taken from online feed of the committee meeting today. It features Patell along with Steve de Eyre, director of public policy and government affairs, Canada at TikTok (centre) and Patrick Rogers, CEO of Music Canada (right).
